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雜志訂閱

一位移民白手起家的傳奇創(chuàng)業(yè)故事

JANE THIER
2023-10-06

2001年10月,他創(chuàng)立了網(wǎng)站托管平臺IPOWER,幾年后這家公司售價接近10億美元。之后他又參與創(chuàng)建了另外三家網(wǎng)站托管公司,包括基于云的商業(yè)通訊軟件公司Nextiva,這是他目前正在經(jīng)營的公司。

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Nextiva創(chuàng)始人托馬斯·高爾尼。圖片由NEXTIVA提供

歡迎來到《財富》雜志的最新欄目“我如何賺到第一桶金”。本欄目采訪了目前最有影響力的人士,了解他們積累財富的過程。在本欄目中,來自世界各地的創(chuàng)始人、企業(yè)家、投資者和創(chuàng)作者分享他們的收入如何達到七位數(shù),他們有哪些與眾不同之處,以及他們對于積累財富的最佳建議。

對于托馬斯·高爾尼,很難對他的身份進行界定。他是波蘭移民,搬到美國的時候幾乎身無分文(甚至不會說英語),他還是科技公司創(chuàng)始人,曾連續(xù)創(chuàng)業(yè),他還曾做過報童,是五個孩子的父親。他還是一位百萬富翁,但他不愿意透露自己的具體身家。

但對于剛剛48歲的高爾尼,最準確的定義或許是他東山再起的能力。他第一次取得巨大成功是在進入千禧年之前,當時他大學肄業(yè)后搬到了洛杉磯,創(chuàng)立了一家網(wǎng)站托管公司。1998年該公司以數(shù)百萬美元的價格售出,這讓他變成了百萬富翁。當時23歲的高爾尼本可以過上舒適的生活。但他第二次創(chuàng)業(yè)時成立的一家銷售互聯(lián)網(wǎng)廣告的公司,卻一敗涂地,他的其他早期投資也損失慘重。他發(fā)現(xiàn)自己又回到了原點,甚至無力支付房貸。

但高爾尼堅定不移地想要在美國取得成功,他最初飛往美國就沒有想過退路,這種精神意味著他不害怕從頭再來。2001年10月,他創(chuàng)立了網(wǎng)站托管平臺IPOWER,幾年后,這家公司被收購,據(jù)媒體報道售價接近10億美元。之后他又參與創(chuàng)建了另外三家網(wǎng)站托管公司,包括基于云的商業(yè)通訊軟件公司Nextiva,這是他目前正在經(jīng)營的公司。

高爾尼是個另類:他在“安息日”不工作,他拒絕花錢買高價咖啡,而且他承認自己“非常不適合為別人打工”,因為他不喜歡循規(guī)蹈矩。但他的事業(yè)卻很成功:2021年,Nextiva從高盛(Goldman Sachs)融資2億美元,估值為27億美元。

所有人都在猜測高爾尼接下來會有哪些創(chuàng)業(yè)靈感,但他向《財富》雜志解釋了是什么讓他保持腳踏實地,決心繼續(xù)尋找新的創(chuàng)業(yè)機會。

您在哪里長大?

共產(chǎn)黨執(zhí)政時期的波蘭。我的父母都是工廠工人,我成長過程中根本沒有機會接觸到商業(yè)和創(chuàng)業(yè)。我出生于1975年,在波蘭一直生活到14歲。在7歲左右的時候,我就有了要到美國的想法。在少年時期,我對美國的了解都是透過課本和美國電影,例如《華爾街》(Wall Street)和《90210》。

后來我住在德國,在上大學期間已經(jīng)創(chuàng)建了兩家公司。我碰巧認識了一個移民到美國回德國探親的人。他對我所做的一切印象深刻,便邀請我加入他的公司。

于是,我畢業(yè)前兩個月選擇了輟學。1996年3月,我搬到洛杉磯,幫助他創(chuàng)建了一家網(wǎng)站托管公司,他給我提供“血汗股權(quán)”。三年左右的時間里,我每天只有3美元的生活費。最終,在1998年,這家公司被出售,我也因此賺到了第一個一百萬,而且實際金額遠不止一百萬。

從經(jīng)濟角度,您如何評價您的童年生活?

非常拮據(jù)。我們沒有車,主要交通工具是公共汽車。沒有電話,只有黑白電視,而且只有一兩個能看的頻道。生活很簡單,但我從來不覺得貧窮,我始終覺得自己得到了妥善的照顧。父母總是鼓勵我要有更多追求。

在您小時候,是什么讓您對商業(yè)和金融產(chǎn)生了興趣?

我總是忙忙碌碌,經(jīng)常組織活動,我還是不同倡議活動的領(lǐng)導(dǎo)者。當沒有人愿意領(lǐng)頭的時候,我總是會站出來。后來,我對解決市場上的大問題產(chǎn)生了興趣。

在搬到德國之后,我的成長過程恰好趕上了PC革命。最初的PC都有DOS手冊,你必須在電腦里輸入長串的命令行才能執(zhí)行任何操作。后來誕生了Windows 1.0,之后又有了Windows 2.0、Windows 3.0。那時候,你只需要點擊一個按鍵,就能輸入長串命令行,在電腦上進行操作。

這是我人生中的一個關(guān)鍵時刻。我當時不知道自己未來能做什么。但我希望能夠使其他人更容易使用科技,因為我看到了Windows為所有人打開了市場,使人人都有機會進入市場。我想?yún)⑴c到那場科技革命當中。

您的第一份工作是什么?這份工作的收入有多少?您從中獲得了哪些與金錢有關(guān)的啟示?

我的第一份工作是在德國做報童。這份工作的收入相對微薄。我要在早上三四點起床去送報,然后去上學,下午則要經(jīng)營我自己的公司。雖然我覺得送報這份工作做得不錯,但我最后還是慘遭解雇。我認為我之所以喜歡創(chuàng)業(yè),部分原因是我非常不適合為別人打工。我有自己的想法。了解德國社會體制的人都知道,德國是一個非常注重過程的國家,你必須遵守規(guī)則。但我不喜歡循規(guī)蹈矩。

我發(fā)現(xiàn),如果自己創(chuàng)業(yè),我會做得更好,因為我會設(shè)定自己的邊界,我會改變現(xiàn)狀。我不能接受當前的現(xiàn)狀就是極限這種觀念。我們可以創(chuàng)造新事物,可以精益求精。

您當時從事的是什么工作?

我成立了兩家公司。一家倒閉了。這家公司的業(yè)務(wù)是銷售CD,但效益不好。父親替我感到難過,于是從我這里買下了一批CD,他成為我的第一位客戶。

后來,我抓住了PC革命帶來的機會。德國有一些大公司開始開展PC業(yè)務(wù),但我想,我們可以做得更好,我們可以將個性化服務(wù)送到用戶家中。于是我們開始創(chuàng)業(yè)[公司名為Trendsetter],但當時我沒有任何資本,所以,我必須一臺一臺地出售電腦。隨著資本增多,我開始拓展業(yè)務(wù)。雖然它沒有變成一家大公司,但對于一個18歲的男孩來說,這家公司依舊有重要的意義。

講講您獲得邀請來到美國的那一刻吧。您如何實現(xiàn)來到美國的夢想?您經(jīng)歷了什么過程?

我為一個移民美國的人創(chuàng)業(yè)的時候,實際上是在上學的強制實習期間。

他回德國探親時,看到我在做的事情,這給他留下了深刻印象。他正準備成立一家網(wǎng)站托管公司。那是在1996年,那家公司是世界上最早的網(wǎng)站托管公司之一。當時我們并不了解互聯(lián)網(wǎng)的用途。他說,和我一起創(chuàng)業(yè)吧。雖然我不能給你任何保證,也付不起你的工資,但我會給你血汗股權(quán)。

于是我放下一切,最終來到美國做各種工作。我上午負責管理公司,晚上在餐廳和公寓樓代客泊車和清潔地毯,還在許多活動上做過侍者。我想方設(shè)法靠每天3美元的生活費維持生計,但我從未自怨自艾。我生活在我喜歡的國家和城市。

您前往美國之前能說哪幾種語言?

波蘭語和德語。我不會英語。實際上,我是在經(jīng)營過程中,通過回復(fù)郵件和與生意伙伴溝通學會了英語。

我在六個月內(nèi)就能用英語流利溝通。許多年之后,我的英語水平不斷提高。不過二十多年后,我依舊有明顯的口音。

您是否有過回德國的念頭?

從來沒有。我經(jīng)歷過一些非常艱難的時期,但德國的環(huán)境不適合我。對我而言,德國是一個風景秀麗的國家,人民能享受到良好的待遇,但這個國家非常保守,人們要遵守許多規(guī)則。我卻是一個喜歡無拘無束的人。我認為美國商機無限。

您提到您每天的生活費只有3美元。您是否不得不使用信用卡,例如簽賬卡,或者您不得不舉債?

初到美國的時候,你必須積累自己的信用。我在支付了一套公寓的首付之后,很快就變得身無分文。貸款機構(gòu)愿意為我提供的貸款還不如我的存款多。因此我當時沒有任何信用貸款。最初,我也沒有社保號碼。我申請了一個社保號碼,并且不得不聘請了律師,因為這樣我就可以合法留在美國。而這讓我變得捉襟見肘。

即使每天的生活費只有3美元,也沒什么大不了。我和一位朋友經(jīng)常在周日去Sizzler吃自助餐。一頓自助餐只需要7美元。我們兩人湊了一筆錢,這樣總是可以有一個人去吃自助餐。那是我每周對自己的獎勵。

您當時如何積累財富?

我并沒有有意積累財富。我始終專注于公司的經(jīng)營。我們知道有網(wǎng)站的人越來越多,但經(jīng)營一個網(wǎng)站依舊成本高昂。我們是最早的網(wǎng)站托管公司之一。很快,大股東開始收到收購這家公司的要約,條件很誘人。

盡管我只是少數(shù)股東,而且如果出售公司,我或許可以獲得更多利益,因為我并沒有公司的控制權(quán),但我還是不太情愿出售公司。我向他提出了反對意見。我說:‘你看,市場正在擴張。最終所有人都會有自己的網(wǎng)站?!?998年決定賣掉公司,兩年半后,他兌現(xiàn)了我們之間的約定,于是我真得在一夜之間擁有了數(shù)百萬美元。

最初收購公司的要約價格是多少?

200萬至600萬美元之間,交易方式是現(xiàn)金和股票組合。我能獲得如此豐厚的回報,原因之一是收購我們的公司最終上市。我們選擇的交易方式是三分之二的現(xiàn)金加三分之一的股份。僅這些股份的價值最終就達到數(shù)千萬美元。

您在多大的時候成了百萬富翁?

在剛到23歲的時候。

對于一個23歲的年輕人來說,這是一筆巨額財富。您當時有什么心路歷程?您是否考慮過聘請一位理財顧問?

我沒有太多或好或壞的想法。我買了一套不錯的房子,首付不到100,000美元。我花40,000美元買了第一輛車,那是一輛梅賽德斯(Mercedes)。如果你了解洛杉磯,你就知道絕對不能依賴公共交通。我與我信任的人一起,將剩下的錢用來投資。很可惜,這是我犯下的錯誤之一。

在此期間,軟銀(Softbank)也投資了我們的一家公司。我和軟銀一起投資創(chuàng)立了這家公司。那是在1998年至1999年期間。兩年后,眾所周知,泡沫破滅。我在一些我信任的人身上犯了一個錯誤,所有資金幾乎損失殆盡。到2001年年中,我已經(jīng)不知道該如何償還下個月的房貸。

當時是一種什么狀況?

我并沒有變得消沉,我依舊認為市場中商機無限。正如我所說的那樣,我曾建議前一家網(wǎng)站托管公司的老板不要將公司出售。通過研究網(wǎng)站托管行業(yè),我認為該領(lǐng)域依舊有巨大商機。沒有人能實現(xiàn)我設(shè)想的愿景:讓非技術(shù)用戶更容易托管網(wǎng)站,跳過中間商,使網(wǎng)站托管的價格更容易承受。

當時911事件結(jié)束后不久,那或許是最不適合創(chuàng)業(yè)的時期之一,但我決定創(chuàng)業(yè)。我持有的股份曾經(jīng)價值高達800萬至1,000萬美元,但一度暴跌至6,000美元。

我最后清算了這些股份,并購買了兩臺服務(wù)器,用于創(chuàng)建網(wǎng)站托管公司。當時我有良好的信用狀況。后來我在自家地下室里,使用美國運通(American Express)的貸款創(chuàng)建了網(wǎng)站托管公司[iPower]。然后我在其他人的辦公室里租了一個很小的隔間,并將其改造成小型辦公室。我招聘了幾名員工。

我們成了美國增長速度最快的網(wǎng)站托管公司。兩年內(nèi),我們變成全世界增長速度最快的網(wǎng)站托管公司。公司在一年內(nèi)的市值就超過了1,000萬美元。

2007年,我們與另外一家比我們規(guī)模更小的公司合并。我們在合并后繼續(xù)拓展網(wǎng)站托管業(yè)務(wù)。2011年,我們以近10億美元的價格將公司出售,后來公司成功上市。如今,它成為僅次于GoDaddy的全球第二大網(wǎng)站托管公司。

您在創(chuàng)建iPower時,用了多長時間使它的市值突破1億美元?

公司市值用了約六年時間達到1.5億美元。

當時,當您得到一大筆工資或某項收入時,您是否覺得這是一筆不可思議的巨額財富,或者您只是想著我要專注于公司經(jīng)營,別無其他想法?

在創(chuàng)業(yè)之初,我就給自己制定了三條原則:與優(yōu)秀的人共事,打造能為客戶創(chuàng)造非凡價值的產(chǎn)品,保證我們能夠獨立掌控自己的命運。

我個人還有一個原則——如果我每個月能賺5,000美元,并且可以償還房貸,我可以一直這樣生活下去。在創(chuàng)業(yè)初期,我們一天只簽約了三位客戶,因為我們的技術(shù)仍在開發(fā)過程中。

我經(jīng)歷了起起伏伏,我真得不想再重復(fù)這樣的日子。我只是盡量專注于新的商機。新軟件發(fā)布后,我們的客戶真得在一夜之間從每天3人,增加到每天200人,一個月內(nèi)達到了2,000名客戶。幾個月內(nèi),我們的客戶突破10,000人。到第一年年底,我們的客戶達到60,000人。

除了房子和車子以外,您有沒有購買過非常昂貴的物品?或者您只是專注于發(fā)展公司和追求成功?

我始終專注于公司的運營。我更喜歡用我對市場的影響力來定義自己,而不是我的資產(chǎn)凈值。除了創(chuàng)業(yè)以外,我沒有太多其他興趣。我這個人很無聊。每當我們在市場上取得一定的成就時,我會開始尋找新的商機。

您曾買過最昂貴的物品是什么?

可能是那套房子。多年來,隨著家庭成員越來越多,我買了幾棟大房子。我有五個孩子,我的房子絕對是我買過最昂貴的物品。

我還聽說您會過安息日。

是的。

為什么它對您而言這么重要?

我小時候根本不遵守教義規(guī)定。但后來我變得更虔誠。這種轉(zhuǎn)變并不是由什么好事引發(fā)的。在第一次創(chuàng)業(yè)失敗后,我決定遵守猶太教的飲食規(guī)律。后來我決定更嚴格地遵守猶太教的規(guī)定。最后,由于生活和家庭中發(fā)生的多件事,我認為最好遵守安息日。過去十年我一直這樣做。

我身邊的人很清楚我的狀況,他們知道一旦發(fā)生嚴重危機能如何聯(lián)系到我。幸運的是,我還沒有被要求在安息日參加其他活動。

您曾說過除了安息日,您每天工作20至22個小時。您把大量時間用于工作。

這并不值得驕傲。我有失眠癥,所以睡得不多。盡管如此,我清楚這并不健康。

您如何發(fā)展Nextiva公司?繼iPower之后,Nextiva如何實現(xiàn)蓬勃發(fā)展?

我一直在尋找市場機會。50多年來,通訊領(lǐng)域鮮有創(chuàng)新。我們知道我們可以在通訊領(lǐng)域產(chǎn)生顯著影響,因為該領(lǐng)域發(fā)展非常迅速。

由于通訊渠道數(shù)字化,我預(yù)計人們將有更多溝通方式。尤其是隨著時間推移,各世代偏好將發(fā)生變化。

因此,我們確立的公司使命是,將所有通信集成到一個平臺,使所有公司,尤其是非技術(shù)類公司,可以與一些大型科技公司公平競爭,使所有人都有對抗科技巨頭的能力。

您目前的資產(chǎn)凈值有多少?

不知道,我并不關(guān)注這個問題。我也不想談?wù)摚驗槲也粫⒆觽冇懻撐业馁Y產(chǎn)。但肯定是一筆龐大的財富。

有道理。對希望積累財富的人們,您認為最重要的建議是什么?

我有三條建議。創(chuàng)業(yè)者在創(chuàng)業(yè)時,不僅要尋找市場空白,還要從空白領(lǐng)域中找到市場。即使你有好創(chuàng)意,而且市場上沒有相關(guān)產(chǎn)品,你也必須評估人們是否愿意為你的創(chuàng)意買單。這會真正提高你成功的概率。

其次,公司創(chuàng)立之后,尤其是在初期,要創(chuàng)建一款能給付費用戶創(chuàng)造更多價值的產(chǎn)品。因為它能幫助你樹立口碑,從而獲得客戶推薦。如果你像我們一樣提供訂閱服務(wù),你就能大幅延長客戶留存時間。

第三條建議是要更專注于發(fā)展公司業(yè)務(wù),而不是公司的財務(wù)業(yè)績。一些創(chuàng)業(yè)者會犯這個錯誤,忽視了公司業(yè)務(wù)的發(fā)展。但如果你專注于發(fā)展業(yè)務(wù),公司的財務(wù)業(yè)績可能會顯著好轉(zhuǎn)。

我有一條原則就是沒有退出策略。我曾經(jīng)賣掉公司,曾收購過公司,也曾將公司上市;這條原則并不意味著我永遠不會退出。但它讓我專注于努力打造最優(yōu)秀的公司。

如果有人想積累財富,他從您的個人經(jīng)歷中得到最大的啟示是什么?

或許就是不要過度專注于積累財富,而是要更重視他們所扮演的社會角色,以及如何成為有生產(chǎn)力的社會成員,為社會做出貢獻。

每天早上,當你起床并開始工作時,會有人依賴你的角色。晚上結(jié)束工作之后,你要問自己一個問題:團隊在有我參與和沒有我參與時,在哪種情況下會變得更好?如果答案是在有我參與的情況下團隊變得更好,這代表你已經(jīng)做好了自己的工作。

您在波蘭長大,生活并不富?!,F(xiàn)在顯然您已經(jīng)擁有巨額財富。您如何培養(yǎng)孩子的金錢觀?

節(jié)儉很重要。在這方面,我妻子比我做得更好。我們經(jīng)常告訴孩子要勤儉節(jié)約。我們不過奢侈的生活,旅行的方式也很簡樸。我最喜歡乘坐西南航空(Southwest)。我經(jīng)常從達拉斯到斯科茨代爾旅行。你不僅要向孩子傳達這種生活理念,還要在生活中言傳身教。我們的房子也并非豪宅。他們確實因為與我們的關(guān)系能獲得一些特權(quán)。但我們之所以不披露資產(chǎn)凈值的原因之一是,我們的資產(chǎn)不應(yīng)該和他們之間存在什么關(guān)聯(lián)。

您會拒絕購買哪些物品?

我感覺定價過高的任何商品。在洛杉磯,連咖啡價格都高得離譜,這讓我無法接受。

如果不買咖啡,您還有哪些替代選擇?

我依舊會偶爾買咖啡,但我在辦公室里會自己沖咖啡。有時候你一進餐廳,就知道會“被宰”。過去兩年,通貨膨脹導(dǎo)致世界發(fā)生了很大變化。我認為某些領(lǐng)域變得不合理。對我而言,不買定價過高的商品只是原則問題。(財富中文網(wǎng))

翻譯:劉進龍

審校:汪皓

歡迎來到《財富》雜志的最新欄目“我如何賺到第一桶金”。本欄目采訪了目前最有影響力的人士,了解他們積累財富的過程。在本欄目中,來自世界各地的創(chuàng)始人、企業(yè)家、投資者和創(chuàng)作者分享他們的收入如何達到七位數(shù),他們有哪些與眾不同之處,以及他們對于積累財富的最佳建議。

對于托馬斯·高爾尼,很難對他的身份進行界定。他是波蘭移民,搬到美國的時候幾乎身無分文(甚至不會說英語),他還是科技公司創(chuàng)始人,曾連續(xù)創(chuàng)業(yè),他還曾做過報童,是五個孩子的父親。他還是一位百萬富翁,但他不愿意透露自己的具體身家。

但對于剛剛48歲的高爾尼,最準確的定義或許是他東山再起的能力。他第一次取得巨大成功是在進入千禧年之前,當時他大學肄業(yè)后搬到了洛杉磯,創(chuàng)立了一家網(wǎng)站托管公司。1998年該公司以數(shù)百萬美元的價格售出,這讓他變成了百萬富翁。當時23歲的高爾尼本可以過上舒適的生活。但他第二次創(chuàng)業(yè)時成立的一家銷售互聯(lián)網(wǎng)廣告的公司,卻一敗涂地,他的其他早期投資也損失慘重。他發(fā)現(xiàn)自己又回到了原點,甚至無力支付房貸。

但高爾尼堅定不移地想要在美國取得成功,他最初飛往美國就沒有想過退路,這種精神意味著他不害怕從頭再來。2001年10月,他創(chuàng)立了網(wǎng)站托管平臺IPOWER,幾年后,這家公司被收購,據(jù)媒體報道售價接近10億美元。之后他又參與創(chuàng)建了另外三家網(wǎng)站托管公司,包括基于云的商業(yè)通訊軟件公司Nextiva,這是他目前正在經(jīng)營的公司。

高爾尼是個另類:他在“安息日”不工作,他拒絕花錢買高價咖啡,而且他承認自己“非常不適合為別人打工”,因為他不喜歡循規(guī)蹈矩。但他的事業(yè)卻很成功:2021年,Nextiva從高盛(Goldman Sachs)融資2億美元,估值為27億美元。

所有人都在猜測高爾尼接下來會有哪些創(chuàng)業(yè)靈感,但他向《財富》雜志解釋了是什么讓他保持腳踏實地,決心繼續(xù)尋找新的創(chuàng)業(yè)機會。

您在哪里長大?

共產(chǎn)黨執(zhí)政時期的波蘭。我的父母都是工廠工人,我成長過程中根本沒有機會接觸到商業(yè)和創(chuàng)業(yè)。我出生于1975年,在波蘭一直生活到14歲。在7歲左右的時候,我就有了要到美國的想法。在少年時期,我對美國的了解都是透過課本和美國電影,例如《華爾街》(Wall Street)和《90210》。

后來我住在德國,在上大學期間已經(jīng)創(chuàng)建了兩家公司。我碰巧認識了一個移民到美國回德國探親的人。他對我所做的一切印象深刻,便邀請我加入他的公司。

于是,我畢業(yè)前兩個月選擇了輟學。1996年3月,我搬到洛杉磯,幫助他創(chuàng)建了一家網(wǎng)站托管公司,他給我提供“血汗股權(quán)”。三年左右的時間里,我每天只有3美元的生活費。最終,在1998年,這家公司被出售,我也因此賺到了第一個一百萬,而且實際金額遠不止一百萬。

從經(jīng)濟角度,您如何評價您的童年生活?

非常拮據(jù)。我們沒有車,主要交通工具是公共汽車。沒有電話,只有黑白電視,而且只有一兩個能看的頻道。生活很簡單,但我從來不覺得貧窮,我始終覺得自己得到了妥善的照顧。父母總是鼓勵我要有更多追求。

在您小時候,是什么讓您對商業(yè)和金融產(chǎn)生了興趣?

我總是忙忙碌碌,經(jīng)常組織活動,我還是不同倡議活動的領(lǐng)導(dǎo)者。當沒有人愿意領(lǐng)頭的時候,我總是會站出來。后來,我對解決市場上的大問題產(chǎn)生了興趣。

在搬到德國之后,我的成長過程恰好趕上了PC革命。最初的PC都有DOS手冊,你必須在電腦里輸入長串的命令行才能執(zhí)行任何操作。后來誕生了Windows 1.0,之后又有了Windows 2.0、Windows 3.0。那時候,你只需要點擊一個按鍵,就能輸入長串命令行,在電腦上進行操作。

這是我人生中的一個關(guān)鍵時刻。我當時不知道自己未來能做什么。但我希望能夠使其他人更容易使用科技,因為我看到了Windows為所有人打開了市場,使人人都有機會進入市場。我想?yún)⑴c到那場科技革命當中。

您的第一份工作是什么?這份工作的收入有多少?您從中獲得了哪些與金錢有關(guān)的啟示?

我的第一份工作是在德國做報童。這份工作的收入相對微薄。我要在早上三四點起床去送報,然后去上學,下午則要經(jīng)營我自己的公司。雖然我覺得送報這份工作做得不錯,但我最后還是慘遭解雇。我認為我之所以喜歡創(chuàng)業(yè),部分原因是我非常不適合為別人打工。我有自己的想法。了解德國社會體制的人都知道,德國是一個非常注重過程的國家,你必須遵守規(guī)則。但我不喜歡循規(guī)蹈矩。

我發(fā)現(xiàn),如果自己創(chuàng)業(yè),我會做得更好,因為我會設(shè)定自己的邊界,我會改變現(xiàn)狀。我不能接受當前的現(xiàn)狀就是極限這種觀念。我們可以創(chuàng)造新事物,可以精益求精。

您當時從事的是什么工作?

我成立了兩家公司。一家倒閉了。這家公司的業(yè)務(wù)是銷售CD,但效益不好。父親替我感到難過,于是從我這里買下了一批CD,他成為我的第一位客戶。

后來,我抓住了PC革命帶來的機會。德國有一些大公司開始開展PC業(yè)務(wù),但我想,我們可以做得更好,我們可以將個性化服務(wù)送到用戶家中。于是我們開始創(chuàng)業(yè)[公司名為Trendsetter],但當時我沒有任何資本,所以,我必須一臺一臺地出售電腦。隨著資本增多,我開始拓展業(yè)務(wù)。雖然它沒有變成一家大公司,但對于一個18歲的男孩來說,這家公司依舊有重要的意義。

講講您獲得邀請來到美國的那一刻吧。您如何實現(xiàn)來到美國的夢想?您經(jīng)歷了什么過程?

我為一個移民美國的人創(chuàng)業(yè)的時候,實際上是在上學的強制實習期間。

他回德國探親時,看到我在做的事情,這給他留下了深刻印象。他正準備成立一家網(wǎng)站托管公司。那是在1996年,那家公司是世界上最早的網(wǎng)站托管公司之一。當時我們并不了解互聯(lián)網(wǎng)的用途。他說,和我一起創(chuàng)業(yè)吧。雖然我不能給你任何保證,也付不起你的工資,但我會給你血汗股權(quán)。

于是我放下一切,最終來到美國做各種工作。我上午負責管理公司,晚上在餐廳和公寓樓代客泊車和清潔地毯,還在許多活動上做過侍者。我想方設(shè)法靠每天3美元的生活費維持生計,但我從未自怨自艾。我生活在我喜歡的國家和城市。

您前往美國之前能說哪幾種語言?

波蘭語和德語。我不會英語。實際上,我是在經(jīng)營過程中,通過回復(fù)郵件和與生意伙伴溝通學會了英語。

我在六個月內(nèi)就能用英語流利溝通。許多年之后,我的英語水平不斷提高。不過二十多年后,我依舊有明顯的口音。

您是否有過回德國的念頭?

從來沒有。我經(jīng)歷過一些非常艱難的時期,但德國的環(huán)境不適合我。對我而言,德國是一個風景秀麗的國家,人民能享受到良好的待遇,但這個國家非常保守,人們要遵守許多規(guī)則。我卻是一個喜歡無拘無束的人。我認為美國商機無限。

您提到您每天的生活費只有3美元。您是否不得不使用信用卡,例如簽賬卡,或者您不得不舉債?

初到美國的時候,你必須積累自己的信用。我在支付了一套公寓的首付之后,很快就變得身無分文。貸款機構(gòu)愿意為我提供的貸款還不如我的存款多。因此我當時沒有任何信用貸款。最初,我也沒有社保號碼。我申請了一個社保號碼,并且不得不聘請了律師,因為這樣我就可以合法留在美國。而這讓我變得捉襟見肘。

即使每天的生活費只有3美元,也沒什么大不了。我和一位朋友經(jīng)常在周日去Sizzler吃自助餐。一頓自助餐只需要7美元。我們兩人湊了一筆錢,這樣總是可以有一個人去吃自助餐。那是我每周對自己的獎勵。

您當時如何積累財富?

我并沒有有意積累財富。我始終專注于公司的經(jīng)營。我們知道有網(wǎng)站的人越來越多,但經(jīng)營一個網(wǎng)站依舊成本高昂。我們是最早的網(wǎng)站托管公司之一。很快,大股東開始收到收購這家公司的要約,條件很誘人。

盡管我只是少數(shù)股東,而且如果出售公司,我或許可以獲得更多利益,因為我并沒有公司的控制權(quán),但我還是不太情愿出售公司。我向他提出了反對意見。我說:‘你看,市場正在擴張。最終所有人都會有自己的網(wǎng)站?!?998年決定賣掉公司,兩年半后,他兌現(xiàn)了我們之間的約定,于是我真得在一夜之間擁有了數(shù)百萬美元。

最初收購公司的要約價格是多少?

200萬至600萬美元之間,交易方式是現(xiàn)金和股票組合。我能獲得如此豐厚的回報,原因之一是收購我們的公司最終上市。我們選擇的交易方式是三分之二的現(xiàn)金加三分之一的股份。僅這些股份的價值最終就達到數(shù)千萬美元。

您在多大的時候成了百萬富翁?

在剛到23歲的時候。

對于一個23歲的年輕人來說,這是一筆巨額財富。您當時有什么心路歷程?您是否考慮過聘請一位理財顧問?

我沒有太多或好或壞的想法。我買了一套不錯的房子,首付不到100,000美元。我花40,000美元買了第一輛車,那是一輛梅賽德斯(Mercedes)。如果你了解洛杉磯,你就知道絕對不能依賴公共交通。我與我信任的人一起,將剩下的錢用來投資。很可惜,這是我犯下的錯誤之一。

在此期間,軟銀(Softbank)也投資了我們的一家公司。我和軟銀一起投資創(chuàng)立了這家公司。那是在1998年至1999年期間。兩年后,眾所周知,泡沫破滅。我在一些我信任的人身上犯了一個錯誤,所有資金幾乎損失殆盡。到2001年年中,我已經(jīng)不知道該如何償還下個月的房貸。

當時是一種什么狀況?

我并沒有變得消沉,我依舊認為市場中商機無限。正如我所說的那樣,我曾建議前一家網(wǎng)站托管公司的老板不要將公司出售。通過研究網(wǎng)站托管行業(yè),我認為該領(lǐng)域依舊有巨大商機。沒有人能實現(xiàn)我設(shè)想的愿景:讓非技術(shù)用戶更容易托管網(wǎng)站,跳過中間商,使網(wǎng)站托管的價格更容易承受。

當時911事件結(jié)束后不久,那或許是最不適合創(chuàng)業(yè)的時期之一,但我決定創(chuàng)業(yè)。我持有的股份曾經(jīng)價值高達800萬至1,000萬美元,但一度暴跌至6,000美元。

我最后清算了這些股份,并購買了兩臺服務(wù)器,用于創(chuàng)建網(wǎng)站托管公司。當時我有良好的信用狀況。后來我在自家地下室里,使用美國運通(American Express)的貸款創(chuàng)建了網(wǎng)站托管公司[iPower]。然后我在其他人的辦公室里租了一個很小的隔間,并將其改造成小型辦公室。我招聘了幾名員工。

我們成了美國增長速度最快的網(wǎng)站托管公司。兩年內(nèi),我們變成全世界增長速度最快的網(wǎng)站托管公司。公司在一年內(nèi)的市值就超過了1,000萬美元。

2007年,我們與另外一家比我們規(guī)模更小的公司合并。我們在合并后繼續(xù)拓展網(wǎng)站托管業(yè)務(wù)。2011年,我們以近10億美元的價格將公司出售,后來公司成功上市。如今,它成為僅次于GoDaddy的全球第二大網(wǎng)站托管公司。

您在創(chuàng)建iPower時,用了多長時間使它的市值突破1億美元?

公司市值用了約六年時間達到1.5億美元。

當時,當您得到一大筆工資或某項收入時,您是否覺得這是一筆不可思議的巨額財富,或者您只是想著我要專注于公司經(jīng)營,別無其他想法?

在創(chuàng)業(yè)之初,我就給自己制定了三條原則:與優(yōu)秀的人共事,打造能為客戶創(chuàng)造非凡價值的產(chǎn)品,保證我們能夠獨立掌控自己的命運。

我個人還有一個原則——如果我每個月能賺5,000美元,并且可以償還房貸,我可以一直這樣生活下去。在創(chuàng)業(yè)初期,我們一天只簽約了三位客戶,因為我們的技術(shù)仍在開發(fā)過程中。

我經(jīng)歷了起起伏伏,我真得不想再重復(fù)這樣的日子。我只是盡量專注于新的商機。新軟件發(fā)布后,我們的客戶真得在一夜之間從每天3人,增加到每天200人,一個月內(nèi)達到了2,000名客戶。幾個月內(nèi),我們的客戶突破10,000人。到第一年年底,我們的客戶達到60,000人。

除了房子和車子以外,您有沒有購買過非常昂貴的物品?或者您只是專注于發(fā)展公司和追求成功?

我始終專注于公司的運營。我更喜歡用我對市場的影響力來定義自己,而不是我的資產(chǎn)凈值。除了創(chuàng)業(yè)以外,我沒有太多其他興趣。我這個人很無聊。每當我們在市場上取得一定的成就時,我會開始尋找新的商機。

您曾買過最昂貴的物品是什么?

可能是那套房子。多年來,隨著家庭成員越來越多,我買了幾棟大房子。我有五個孩子,我的房子絕對是我買過最昂貴的物品。

我還聽說您會過安息日。

是的。

為什么它對您而言這么重要?

我小時候根本不遵守教義規(guī)定。但后來我變得更虔誠。這種轉(zhuǎn)變并不是由什么好事引發(fā)的。在第一次創(chuàng)業(yè)失敗后,我決定遵守猶太教的飲食規(guī)律。后來我決定更嚴格地遵守猶太教的規(guī)定。最后,由于生活和家庭中發(fā)生的多件事,我認為最好遵守安息日。過去十年我一直這樣做。

我身邊的人很清楚我的狀況,他們知道一旦發(fā)生嚴重危機能如何聯(lián)系到我。幸運的是,我還沒有被要求在安息日參加其他活動。

您曾說過除了安息日,您每天工作20至22個小時。您把大量時間用于工作。

這并不值得驕傲。我有失眠癥,所以睡得不多。盡管如此,我清楚這并不健康。

您如何發(fā)展Nextiva公司?繼iPower之后,Nextiva如何實現(xiàn)蓬勃發(fā)展?

我一直在尋找市場機會。50多年來,通訊領(lǐng)域鮮有創(chuàng)新。我們知道我們可以在通訊領(lǐng)域產(chǎn)生顯著影響,因為該領(lǐng)域發(fā)展非常迅速。

由于通訊渠道數(shù)字化,我預(yù)計人們將有更多溝通方式。尤其是隨著時間推移,各世代偏好將發(fā)生變化。

因此,我們確立的公司使命是,將所有通信集成到一個平臺,使所有公司,尤其是非技術(shù)類公司,可以與一些大型科技公司公平競爭,使所有人都有對抗科技巨頭的能力。

您目前的資產(chǎn)凈值有多少?

不知道,我并不關(guān)注這個問題。我也不想談?wù)?,因為我不會跟孩子們討論我的資產(chǎn)。但肯定是一筆龐大的財富。

有道理。對希望積累財富的人們,您認為最重要的建議是什么?

我有三條建議。創(chuàng)業(yè)者在創(chuàng)業(yè)時,不僅要尋找市場空白,還要從空白領(lǐng)域中找到市場。即使你有好創(chuàng)意,而且市場上沒有相關(guān)產(chǎn)品,你也必須評估人們是否愿意為你的創(chuàng)意買單。這會真正提高你成功的概率。

其次,公司創(chuàng)立之后,尤其是在初期,要創(chuàng)建一款能給付費用戶創(chuàng)造更多價值的產(chǎn)品。因為它能幫助你樹立口碑,從而獲得客戶推薦。如果你像我們一樣提供訂閱服務(wù),你就能大幅延長客戶留存時間。

第三條建議是要更專注于發(fā)展公司業(yè)務(wù),而不是公司的財務(wù)業(yè)績。一些創(chuàng)業(yè)者會犯這個錯誤,忽視了公司業(yè)務(wù)的發(fā)展。但如果你專注于發(fā)展業(yè)務(wù),公司的財務(wù)業(yè)績可能會顯著好轉(zhuǎn)。

我有一條原則就是沒有退出策略。我曾經(jīng)賣掉公司,曾收購過公司,也曾將公司上市;這條原則并不意味著我永遠不會退出。但它讓我專注于努力打造最優(yōu)秀的公司。

如果有人想積累財富,他從您的個人經(jīng)歷中得到最大的啟示是什么?

或許就是不要過度專注于積累財富,而是要更重視他們所扮演的社會角色,以及如何成為有生產(chǎn)力的社會成員,為社會做出貢獻。

每天早上,當你起床并開始工作時,會有人依賴你的角色。晚上結(jié)束工作之后,你要問自己一個問題:團隊在有我參與和沒有我參與時,在哪種情況下會變得更好?如果答案是在有我參與的情況下團隊變得更好,這代表你已經(jīng)做好了自己的工作。

您在波蘭長大,生活并不富裕?,F(xiàn)在顯然您已經(jīng)擁有巨額財富。您如何培養(yǎng)孩子的金錢觀?

節(jié)儉很重要。在這方面,我妻子比我做得更好。我們經(jīng)常告訴孩子要勤儉節(jié)約。我們不過奢侈的生活,旅行的方式也很簡樸。我最喜歡乘坐西南航空(Southwest)。我經(jīng)常從達拉斯到斯科茨代爾旅行。你不僅要向孩子傳達這種生活理念,還要在生活中言傳身教。我們的房子也并非豪宅。他們確實因為與我們的關(guān)系能獲得一些特權(quán)。但我們之所以不披露資產(chǎn)凈值的原因之一是,我們的資產(chǎn)不應(yīng)該和他們之間存在什么關(guān)聯(lián)。

您會拒絕購買哪些物品?

我感覺定價過高的任何商品。在洛杉磯,連咖啡價格都高得離譜,這讓我無法接受。

如果不買咖啡,您還有哪些替代選擇?

我依舊會偶爾買咖啡,但我在辦公室里會自己沖咖啡。有時候你一進餐廳,就知道會“被宰”。過去兩年,通貨膨脹導(dǎo)致世界發(fā)生了很大變化。我認為某些領(lǐng)域變得不合理。對我而言,不買定價過高的商品只是原則問題。(財富中文網(wǎng))

翻譯:劉進龍

審校:汪皓

Welcome to “How I Made My First Million,” Fortune’s newest series in which we interview today’s most powerful people about how they amassed their wealth. You’ll hear from founders, entrepreneurs, investors, and creatives across the globe on how they joined the seven-figure-club, what they’d do differently, and their best piece of advice for building wealth.

Tomas Gorny is difficult to categorize. He’s a Polish immigrant who moved to the U.S. with absolutely nothing (not even the ability to speak English), a tech founder, a serial entrepreneur, a former paperboy, and a father of five. He also has millions—but he won’t tell you how much.

But perhaps Gorny, who just turned 48, is best defined by his ability to rise from the ashes. His first major success came just before the turn of the millennium, when, after dropping out of college, he moved to Los Angeles to work on a website hosting business, which sold in 1998 for several million dollars, making him a millionaire. Gorny, then 23, should have been set for life. But his next endeavor—a business selling Internet ads—crashed spectacularly, along with the rest of his early investments. He found himself back at square one, unable to pay his mortgage.

But Gorny’s insistence on making it in the U.S.—he considered his flight here to be a one-way ticket—meant he was undaunted by starting over. He founded web-hosting platform IPOWER in October 2001, which a few years later would be acquired for reportedly almost $1 billion. He’s since co-founded three more companies in the web hosting space, including his current business Nextiva, a cloud-based business communications software firm.

Gorny is unorthodox; he doesn’t work on the Sabbath, he refuses to shell out for overpriced coffee, and by his own admission, is “not very hireable” because he doesn’t take well to following rules. But he’s doing something right; Nextiva received $200 million in funding from Goldman Sachs in 2021, giving it a $2.7 billion valuation.

It’s anyone’s guess where Gorny will find inspiration next, but he revealed to Fortune what keeps him grounded and determined to keep searching.

Where did you grow up?

Communist Poland. My parents were essentially factory workers. My exposure to business and entrepreneurship was non-existent. I was born in 1975, and [for] the first 14 years of my life, I lived there. I already knew, by around the age of seven, that I wanted to come to America. As a teenager, my exposure to the U.S. was really through textbooks and American movies like Wall Street and 90210.

I was, at this time, living in Germany, and already started a couple of businesses while going to college. And I happened to know somebody who moved to the U.S. and returned for a visit. He was very impressed with everything I was doing, and he offered me to join his business.

So I dropped out of school two months before graduating, and in March of 1996, I moved to Los Angeles to help him to start a web site hosting business for sweat equity. For about three years, I was living off $3 a day. Finally, in 1998 the business ended up selling, and that’s how I made my very first million—and significantly more.

What would you say your life was like during childhood, financially?

Very constrained. We didn’t have a car. Our primary form of transportation was a bus. We didn’t have a telephone, we had black and white TV, where there were a couple of channels to stream. Life was very simple. I never felt poor, I always felt that I was well-taken care of. And my parents always encouraged me to do more.

What got your interest in business and finance when you were younger?

I was always hustling around, always the organizer, the leader of different initiatives. I always stepped in when there was nobody willing to lead. Later in my life, I developed a taste for solving big problems in the market.

When we moved to Germany, I grew up during the era of the PC revolution. And the very first PCs had the DOS manuals, where you had to really write those long string command lines on your computer to get anything done. And then Windows 1.0 came around, Windows 2.0, Windows 3.0. At hat point, you were able to do everything you had to do with typing those long string command lines, just with a click of a button.

That was a pivotal moment in my life. I said, I don’t know what I’m going to do in my life. But I want to be a part of making tech easier for other people. Because I saw how Windows opened the market to everybody and made it accessible. I wanted to be part of the tech revolution.

What was your first job? How much money did you make doing it? What did it teach you about money?

A paperboy in Germany. It made relatively very little. I was literally waking up at three or four in the morning, doing the paperboy job, going to school, and in the afternoon, I was running my business. Although I thought I was doing a good job, I ended up getting fired. I think part of the reason why I’m entrepreneurial is because I’m not very hireable. I have a mind on my own. And if anybody knows how Germany functions, it’s a very process-oriented country. You have to follow the rules. I am not a rule follower.

I found that I will be ultimately better on my own because I set boundaries, I changed the status quo. I don’t accept that what exists today is the limit. We can create new things, and we can make them better.

What was the job that you were running?

I started a couple of companies. One has failed. [I was] just selling CDs, and it wasn’t going well. And my dad felt bad for me and ended up buying a bunch of CDs for me—he became my very first customer.

Later, I really took advantage of the PC revolution. And there were some big companies in Germany building businesses, but I thought, we can do it better by delivering personalized service, right to people’s homes. We started building that business [called Trendsetter], and I didn’t have any capital. So I literally needed to sell one computer at a time. Eventually, as the capital grew, I started expanding that, and it became not a large business, but it was still substantial for an 18-year-old boy.

Talk me through that moment when you got the offer to come to the United States. How did you manifest that? What were your steps to get there?

When I was building my business for the person who moved to America, I was actually doing a mandatory internship for him while I was going to school.

As he was coming back to visit his family in Germany, he saw what I was doing with the businesses, and he was very impressed. He was just about to start a website hosting company. It was 1996, one of the very first website hosting companies in the world. We didn’t know what the internet would do at that point. He says, join me. There are no guarantees, I cannot afford to pay you, but I will give you sweat equity.

I dropped everything, ended up in the U.S. doing various jobs. While I was looking at the business in the morning, at night I was parking cars, cleaning carpets at restaurants and apartment buildings, doing various waiter jobs at events. I was doing whatever it took to survive on three bucks a day, but I never pitied myself. I was living in the country and the city I loved.

What languages did you speak prior to coming to the United States?

Polish and German. I didn’t speak English. Essentially, I ended up learning by answering emails and by interacting with people in the business.

Within six months, I was able to communicate fairly well. And then over many, many years, my skills have improved. Twenty-plus years later, I still have a pretty significant accent.

Did you ever have a thought like, maybe I should move back to Germany?

No, and I went through some very tough times. But Germany wasn’t the right environment. For me, it’s a beautiful country and treats people well, but it’s a very conservative country and lived by a lot of rules. I’m more of a free spirit. For me, America was the land of opportunity.

You mentioned you had to live off $3 a day, essentially. Did you ever have to take out credit cards, like charge cards, or get into debt?

Back then, when you came to America, you had to build your own credit. I ran out of money very, very quickly by putting a down payment on an apartment. My deposit was larger than the credit that they would give me. So I didn’t have any credit. At the beginning, I didn’t have a social security number. I applied for one, and I needed to hire a lawyer, so I could stay legally in the country. So all of that, you know, will put a big strain on my financial position.

Even with living on $3 a day, it wasn’t a big deal. A friend of mine and I would always on Sundays made the trip to Sizzler—all you can eat. It was essentially a $7 meal. We put a bunch of our money together, and one of us was always going to the buffet. That was my treat for the week.

How were you able to accumulate wealth at that time?

I wasn’t. The goal was really to focus on the business. We knew that more and more people would have websites, but having a website was still expensive. We were one of the very first website hosting companies out there. And very, very quickly, the majority owner started getting pretty good offers for the business.

I was a little bit reluctant, although I was the minority owner, and I probably had more interest in selling the business because I wasn’t in control. I was advising him against this. I said, ‘Look, this market is going to expand. Eventually everybody will have a website.’ And he decided to sell in 1998 and, two-and-a-half years later, he honored the arrangement that we had, and I ended up becoming a multi-millionaire literally overnight.

What were the first offers?

They were in the range of $2 to $6 million, and it was a cash and stock deal. But the reason it dropped out so beautifully is because the company who acquired us ended up going public. And we took two-thirds in cash and one-third in stock. The stock alone ended up being in the tens of millions of dollars.

You’re how old when you got the million dollars?

I had just turned 23.

That’s a lot of money for 23-year-olds. What was your thought process? Did you think about getting a financial advisor?

Not quite, for good or bad. I bought a modest house, where I put down a down payment of less than $100,000. I bought my very first car—a Mercedes—for $40,000. If you know LA, you know you cannot rely on public transportation. The rest I invested, along with people I trusted. Unfortunately, that was part of my mistake.

Along the way, Softbank also came around and invested in one of our businesses. And I invested along with Softbank to start the business. This was all in 1998 to 1999. Two years later, you know, the bubble bursts. Some of the people that I trusted, I made a mistake on, and all of that money was essentially gone. By the middle of 2001, I didn’t know how to pay my next mortgage.

What was that moment like?

I wasn’t down on myself, I still saw the market as a huge opportunity. As I mentioned, I was advising the prior owner of the website hosting company not to sell. And I looked at the website hosting landscape, and I said to myself, there’s still a huge opportunity. Nobody has done what I envisioned doing: making website hosting easier for the non-technical users, taking the middleman out, making it significantly more affordable.

Around that time, right after September 11, was probably one of the worst times to start the business. I decided to start a business. At one point, the stock that I had, which was worth probably between $8 to $10 million crashed and was worth $6,000.

I ended up liquidating that stock and buying a couple of servers for the web hosting company. At that point, I had good credit. And then I started the website hosting company [iPower] on an American Express out of my basement. Later, I rented a very small closet in somebody else’s office and converted it to a little office. Then I put a couple of people in.

We became the fastest growing website hosting company in the United States. Within a couple of years, we were the fastest growing website hosting company in the world. The business was, within a year, worth more than $10 million.

In 2007, we merged with another business that was a little bit smaller than we were. Together, we continued to build the business. In 2011, we sold that business for nearly a billion dollars, then we took it public.Today, it is the second largest website hosting company after GoDaddy.

When you started iPower, how long did it take for you to pass the $100 million-dollar plateau?

It took us around six years to get to $150 million.

When you got a paycheck or something at that time, and it was for an exorbitant amount of money, did you ever have the thought of, this is an insane amount of money, or it was just kind of, No, I’m just focusing on it?

When we started, I set three rules for myself: Working with great people, creating a product that provides amazing value to customers, and making sure that we can stay independent and in charge of our own destiny.

And I had some personal rules—if I can just get to making $5,000 a month and pay for that mortgage, I can live like that forever, literally. I was still in the very early days, where we were signing just three customers a day because we were still developing our tech.

I came from this up and down, where I wasn’t trying to make it back. I was just trying to focus on the new opportunity. When we launched the new software, we literally overnight went from three customers a day, 200 customers a day, 2,000 a month. Within a couple of months, we were acquiring 10,000 customers. We got, by the first end of the first year to 60,000.

Did you ever purchase anything outside of the house or car that was really expensive? Or were you just focusing on putting it towards the business and letting it succeed?

Always focusing on the business. I define myself more by the impact I can make in the marketplace versus my net worth. And generally, I don’t have that many interests outside of the business. I’m a pretty boring guy. We accomplished one piece in the market, and I was looking for the next opportunity.

What is the most expensive thing you’ve ever purchased?

It probably would be that house. Over the years, I purchased some larger homes because my family grew. I have five children, but the house definitely was my largest purchase.

I’ve also heard you observe the Sabbath.

Yeah, I do.

Why is that important to you?

When I grew up, I wasn’t observant at all. Eventually I became more religious. That was sometimes triggered by not-so-positive events. When my first business went down, I decided to keep kosher. Later, I decided to be a little bit more observant. Eventually, because of various circumstances in our life and family, I decided it would be good to keep Shabbat. For the last 10 years, that’s what I’ve been doing.

The people around me are very much aware of the circumstances, they know how to reach me, ultimately, if there will be a huge crisis. And, thankfully, I haven’t been required to jump in on Shabbat yet.

You’ve said you work 20 to 22 hours a day, except for Shabbat. That’s a lot of hours.

It’s not a proud statement. I just have insomnia, so I don’t sleep that much. But having said that, look, it’s not a healthy thing. I know that.

How did you develop Nextiva? How did that come into development from iPower?

I was looking at market opportunities. There was very little innovation in communication done for over 50 years. And we knew that we can make a significant impact in communication given that the world of conversation was developing very quickly.

Because of the digitization of communication channels, I anticipated there will be more ways for people to have conversations. Especially because generational preferences will change over time.

So we made it our mission to be the company that brings all conversations together in one place, and allows every business, especially the non-technical businesses, to really be able to level the playing field between some of those really large technical businesses, so people can compete against the big giants.

What would you say your total net worth is today?

I don’t know. I generally don’t pay attention to this. I also don’t want to talk about it because I don’t talk about it to my children. But it’s substantial.

Fair enough. What would be the number one piece of advice you’d give us all looking to accumulate wealth?

I have three pieces of advice. When an entrepreneur starts a business, he or she not only should be looking for the gap in the market, but for the market in the gap. Even if you have a good idea, and there is a lack of a product in the market, you really have to assess whether people will be willing to pay for it. And that truly increases your chances of success.

Secondly, after you establish this, create a product, especially in the early stage, that delivers more value that people are paying for. Because it establishes word of mouth, it allows you to get referrals. And if you’re in a subscription business like us, you will be able to keep your customer significantly longer.

The third is to focus more on building a business, versus focusing on the financial outcome of the business. Some entrepreneurs make that mistake and forget to build a business. But when you focus on building the business, the financial outcome will be maybe significantly better.

I have the rule of no exit strategy. And I have sold businesses, bought businesses, taken businesses public; that doesn’t mean that I never will do this. But it puts me in the frame of mind that I am focusing on creating the best business possible.

What is the biggest takeaway someone who wants to build wealth can glean from your personal journey?

Probably not so much focusing on wealth accumulation, more focusing on which role and how they can be productive members of society and how they contribute to it.

When you wake up every morning, and you get on the field, there will be people that rely on you. So when you get off that field at night, you’ve got to ask yourself the question: Was the team better with me or without me? If the answer is positive, you have done your part.

Growing up, you’re in Poland and didn’t have a whole ton of money. Now, obviously, your wealth is extensive. How do you teach the value of money to your kids?

The main thing is frugality. And my wife is actually significantly better at that than I am. They hear that from us all the time. We don’t live a lavish life. We don’t travel lavishly. My airline of preference is Southwest. I travel often from Dallas to Scottsdale. You can not only just communicate it to them, but they see how we’ll live. Even the homes that we live in. Yes, they are very privileged by association. But you know, part of the reason why we’re also not disclosing our net worth: It should be irrelevant.

What are some things you refuse to spend money on?

Anything I feel is overpriced. Even coffee prices in LA have been astronomical, I just cannot get myself around that.

What’s your alternative to buying coffee?

I still do it off and on, but I make my coffee in the office. But there are times that you just go into restaurants and you know you’re being gouged. The world has changed quite a bit over the last couple of years with inflation. I think in some areas, it became very unreasonable. To me, it’s just a matter of principle.

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